Exercise? Not to exercise?

[minime]

Just a follow up to my first original post about the exercise. I spoke with the clinic and the outcome was basically if I'm feeling hungry then I should stop doing as much cardio as I'm burning to many calories and switch to either walking or strength and toning relating exercise (weights and yoga). And it's ok to start and stop. Best gauge is how your hungry your feeling....

I lost about 3kgs less this month than I did in the first month. (I know that it's probably the case with everyone considering the first week seems to bring upwards of 3kg loss), but I'm also concerned that it may be the exercise. If I feel like going for a walk I will - I'm not going to be strict about doing it though.

Will gauge on this month and see how things average out.

Cheers
MiniMe

[Peter 14.7]

Hey Minime

Disclaimer: This post is sent in good faith but touches on personal issues, please excuse any offence.

FYI I use to be gym instructor so I have training and study in exercise.

So I assume you know the rule that muscle weighs more than fat.

So you could be losing 2cm of fat and gaining 1 cm of muscle and still be the same weight.

This is ok provided it does not affect your motivation.

As you very active and from your BMI very large, you have a challenge.

Perhaps you will have to sacrifice the exercise for a period to lose the weight.
Personally I have put growing my business, and building my new home a lower priority than losing the weight. I know I can come back to either but I have put off weight loss for years saying when I have the time and I ballooned to 112kg. I thought I would never go over 100kg.

I know less exercise feels wrong. Many persons have asked me with my results so far "how much exercise"? I say none above normal walking. The response is usually “that is wrong.”

Also you should consider the strain on your joints that the exercise may be causing. If you are under 30 it is unlikely to be an issue but I can assure you as you age those minor injuries become arthritis, joint grind, back pain, etc...

With almost 14kg down I feel 5 years younger. I can move faster and work longer. I see this as being the advantage I gain when the weight is off, to be able to hit the gym hard and bike and hike and garden (I have big garden) with ease and power.

Being hungry is the lack of carbs talking. I sent 4 days in Sydney walking around for business and I was hungry. At home where I dont walk near as much, I am ok.

It would have been easy at the business brekkie to eat all the onion instead of sum arguing that I was walking around but I came back and had dropped 2kg so that onion wasn’t worth it.

I know it is hard to give that up but a balance must be found and goals prioritised.

I hope this helps, Peter 14.7

[Brieziel]

Minime i used to be an exercise freak, walking almost every morning, going to the gym 3 nights a week and riding my horses on the weekends.... i was very fit, but still fat and overweight. Since stsrting Cohens all i do now is ride on the weekends.

The Weight has fallen off.

When i reach goal weight i will concentrate on increasing my strength and toning, but untill that point i will let my body focus on burning the unneccessary fat that is on my body.

I spoke to Sue from my clinic and she said if it does not make you hungry that it is ok for me to do light exercise, especially as i am near completetion and my body may need the kick start to loose the rest of the weight and increase body tone.

[lessfatty]

My opinion is that like many of us we get caught in the insulin trap, eating just too much starchy foods each day over years and decades, causing insulin resistance and its flip side of obesity.

In the calorie is a calorie and can be burned off by exercise thinking, many people feel that being fat is a result of lack of exercise.

I agree with Peter, time to 100% focus on reducing obesity getting your insulin levels under control, Cohen is a great way to do that.

On err problem if you want to call it that with Cohen is that because we are not eating a big supply of energy rich starches and sugars we need to take care with heavy exercise programs as our bodies are burning fat (lipolysis) and heavy duty exercise apparently can overtax this process.

However I personally think we should be as active as possible, I suppose it is just shades of gray between couch potato => moderate activity => exercise. Busy Mums with kids cannot stop all "activities" needed each day because it is enough to look like exercise, is house work exercise, is painting exercise, walking to the shops?. Cohen guide says we can continue moderate exercise whilst on the program but we shouldn't start if we are not doing it currently.

[minime]

Thanks guys.... Peter no offence taken It's true obviously that I am overweight, have been for many years through periods of losing weight and putting it back on. It's only been this last time since I've put it back on that I can actually see the decline of muscle tone throughout my body. I guess to give you some idea my body type is similar to Mel on the Biggest Loser (if you watch it)

I have been very active throughout my life. Played heaps of sport at school - tennis, cricket, netball, rowing, swimming, football, climbing trees, roller skating, skate boarding, bike riding, horse riding, walking, yoga, pilates etc etc.

For whatever reason I got to be this size, I've always maintained my fitness and losing that is I guess what I'm struggling with the most. If I don't exercise to the point that my body hurts - I don't see the point

I agree with all of you that in doing this program with no or only light to moderate exercise I am allowing my body to create the right environment for it to function correctly and balance whatever needs balancing. So for the next few months I will forget about extreme exercising and let that be my reward for my new skinny body. Will get back into training then - might even get me a hot personal trainer to train me properly!!!

Oh and Peter - I've only just turned 30 so no arthritisy, grindy joints yet!!!

Cheers
MiniMe

[Peter 14.7]

Originally Posted by minime

So for the next few months I will forget about extreme exercising and let that be my reward for my new skinny body. Will get back into training then - might even get me a hot personal trainer to train me properly!!!

Cheers
MiniMe

You go GIRL!

Peter

[sofiya_divoted]

I was wondering if i exercised and did brisk cardio would it make the weight loss faster? its funny cause ever since ive lost some weight, i really want to go for walks/jogs around the lake where i live. will it benefit my weight loss by doing that or will it not make a difference or will it slow my weight loss down? would love to hear some opinions!
thanks
sofiya!

[sofiya_divoted]

never mind my question lol! have called my clinic and ill post her response on here incase anyone else is curious.

Basically she told me cohens works on triggeirng your HGH to burn fat within your own chemical environment. It's not a calorie based exercise program where the exercise is meant to burn off the weight. She said its not advisable on cohens because the exercise will of course use your food reserves first and can leave you feeling lethargic. You might even crave stuff you're not alllowed. I've had a bad month and thought exercise would solve the problem but I guess focusing on my diet and making sure it's 100% right will help!

[sofiya_divoted]

Hi!
I made a thread in another section of the forum without realising there was one here. But then I was calling up my consultant regarding my blood test and so decided to ask her about exercise.

Basically she told me cohens works on triggeirng your HGH to burn fat within your own chemical environment. It's not a calorie based exercise program where the exercise is meant to burn off the weight. She said its not advisable on cohens because the exercise will of course use your food reserves first and can leave you feeling lethargic. You might even crave stuff you're not alllowed. I've had a bad month and thought exercise would solve the problem but I guess focusing on my diet and making sure it's 100% right will help!

[Peter 14.7]

Hi Sofiya_Divoted

If you check the exacting posts ofthe diaries of myslef and Baloo you can see we do best when Pure Cohens. No deviations.

The only exercise I do is walking and gardening. When I lose the fat, weight training with increased protien is the plan. Aerobic training uses glycogen, etc.. and the way Cohens works is counter productive.

I liken Cohens to "running a dual fuel car".

Car ( your body) can be petrol (glucose from carbs) or LP gas ( fat from stores) driven

BUT
If you want to go very fast ( exercise) you must use petrol (carbs)
If you are cruising (low exercise) you can use gas (fat)

But you cannot go hard on gas.

We have been adding to our gas tanks too much and it is overloaded , spilling out, slowing down the car overall (metabolisim) and affecting the engine (your body).

We need to empty the gastank to go fast again.

Peter

[lessfatty]

Originally Posted by sofiya_divoted

never mind my question lol! have called my clinic and ill post her response on here incase anyone else is curious.

Basically she told me Cohen's works on triggering your HGH to burn fat within your own chemical environment. It's not a calorie based exercise program where the exercise is meant to burn off the weight. She said its not advisable on Cohen's because the exercise will of course use your food reserves first and can leave you feeling lethargic. You might even crave stuff you're not allowed. I've had a bad month and thought exercise would solve the problem but I guess focusing on my diet and making sure it's 100% right will help!

It is my belief the real reason is a little bit "darker" than the consultant staff state. However it is nothing to do with the specifics of the Cohen diet as such , just a problem with any low calorie diet. Cohen is low calorie, just we don't count calories, if we did count then we eat less than 1000 per day and for ladies I estimate around 800!


What happens in any low calorie diet, is that the regular sugar fuel for muscles, glucose and glycogen gets depleted to quite low levels which is fine as then fat reserves are metabolised (lipolysis) to provide alternative fuel/energy.

This fat burning/lipolysis is exactly what we want because this is the only way to lose fat is for our bodies to burn it. During strenuous exercise muscles need plentiful supplies of glucose/glycogen, and if not enough is available there is a crunch-time when your muscles simply run out. When your muscles consume the available glucose/glycogen you will feel tired and the muscles will send a signal to your body to supply more fuel, your the body responded by sending signals to extract more fat for burning...sounds great news right? increased fat burning?

Actually this is not so great, since your body will take some time to start the fat burning your muscles being in energy crisis decide to burn something/anything else, in crisis mode muscles turn to burn proteins for fuel. Where do they get the proteins to burn, from themselves => your muscles will literal eat themselves for fuel, which will result overtime in reduced muscle mass which is not good!. Its a bit like deciding to burn your dinning table and other furniture in the fire because you are freezing and the wood hasn't been delivered yet.

It is my belief that moderate activity is best on Cohen, never push your body past feeling tired (that hard to describe body feeling that energy is low and you should slow down)! Leave "going for the burn" for when you are finished Cohen and can eat more carbs

[jools]

Hey guys,
I was only 32 when my arthritisy, grindy bits started. AND there isnt any family history. Just lucky I guess.

On the exercise front..I went to deep water running on Wednesday night (no stress on joints) and loved it and better still, didnt become hungry

[baloo]

The whole "No Exercise" thing about Cohen's is what gave me the first concerns in the beginning of the program. I've no accepted the fact and deal with it.

I will start hitting the gym soon. When I break into the double figures I'll start some light cardio work. Nothing too strenuous but I need to do something before I start to walk with a limp. Thanks to playing serious competitive rugby while I was a good 15kg overweight, a lot of my joints are screwed. Definite Osteo Arthritis in my right knee. Cartlidge and ligament damage in a wrist. An Ankle that when turned in a certain way, grinds and clicks so loud that people in the next room can hear it. A left shoulder that's had a dislocated AC joint for 15 years now.

I'm starting to feel more pain in these joints as I'm losing weight. Either it's a "phantom" pain that is just popping back to say hello. Or, as I believe, as the fat deposits melt away, I am starting to get more friction in them, hence the pain. Either way, I know I need a certain level of fitness to stay in shape.

I'll monitor the effects of going to the gym closely. I'm hoping there will be no negative impact and so far the signs look good as when I play golf, I tend to lose more weight the next day, not less. I reckon 4 weeks of cardio then some easy weights is the way to go but with an eye on the scale and ready to stop the work if the weight loss slows down too much.

I know Santa says no exercise but I really do miss a hard gym session and the endorphins rush it triggers.

[lessfatty]

Originally Posted by Baloo

The whole "No Exercise" thing about Cohen's is what gave me the first concerns in the beginning of the program. I've no accepted the fact and deal with it.

I will start hitting the gym soon. When I break into the double figures I'll start some light cardio work. Nothing too strenuous but I need to do something before I start to walk with a limp. Thanks to playing serious competitive rugby while I was a good 15kg overweight, a lot of my joints are screwed. Definite Osteo Arthritis in my right knee. Cartlidge and ligament damage in a wrist. An Ankle that when turned in a certain way, grinds and clicks so loud that people in the next room can hear it. A left shoulder that's had a dislocated AC joint for 15 years now.

I'm starting to feel more pain in these joints as I'm losing weight. Either it's a "phantom" pain that is just popping back to say hello. Or, as I believe, as the fat deposits melt away, I am starting to get more friction in them, hence the pain. Either way, I know I need a certain level of fitness to stay in shape.

I'll monitor the effects of going to the gym closely. I'm hoping there will be no negative impact and so far the signs look good as when I play golf, I tend to lose more weight the next day, not less. I reckon 4 weeks of cardio then some easy weights is the way to go but with an eye on the scale and ready to stop the work if the weight loss slows down too much.

I know Santa says no exercise but I really do miss a hard gym session and the endorphins rush it triggers.

In another thread on exercise I worry that strenuous exercise on low calorie diets it can cause muscle wasting rather (catabolism) the exact opposite of what you want to achieve, this due to the low level of glucose/glycogen in your muscles resulting in "crisis mode" protein metabolism during heavy exercise. Personally golf seems to me the perfect exercise for you on the program, you always get a nice drop and it really is good low intensity exercise, can you play another 9 or 18 holes each week?

I didn't have any joint problems during the program, my suggestion is that toxins/waste/cr@p stored in body fat is being circulated before being flushed out and maybe making a few problems with your joints. Have you had another blood test, did your uric acid or blood protein level increase? neither are good for joints - my uric acid level climbed to above normal after starting the diet!

[jools]

Baloo. I too am feeling a little more achy and more joint soreness since my weight loss. Maybe it's because there is no fat around the joints to cushion it. I am about to start a new medication of pure chronditin (spelling) hopefully it will help

[baloo]

Yeah, I hear what you're saying LF. Maybe lift cardio is enough.

Suffering from Gout, Uric Acid levels are always high. It's why I try and drink as much water as I can.

[minime]

At the start of this program, I really struggled with the thought of not doing any exercise at all. In fact I really couldn't fathom the fact that I could lose weight without doing anything but eating.

I started out the first month doing 3 sessions a week of (what I consider) light cardio. During the second month I increased this to 5 sessions a week including walking on alternate days and an hour of yoga on Saturday and Sunday. I was concerned I was doing too much when I started waking up in the mornings absolutely starving.

After a lot of consideration, I decided to stop exercising whilst doing this program. I thought that I would lapse into old habits. I'm of the mindset that when I'm on a fitness mission I don't allow myself any form of junk food. The minute I break that rule and have chocolate or anything that's not fresh fruit, vegetables or protein, I stop with the exercise and allow the crap to creep back in.

Cohens has taught me a whole new way of looking at my exercise and eating habits.

I believe that it is better for you, as advised, to not do any exercise whilst on the program. I think that this month (month 3) I have lost more than when I was exercising (month 2). Hard to tell though cause I did deviate with chocolate and chips on Easter Sunday and that has cost me 4 days of good weight loss. I went up on Monday, down slightly on Tuesday, about the same Wednesday, small loss Thursday and then back to normal (approx 0.5kg) this morning. (Although again hard to tell because I'm premenstrual (sorry guys!!) at the moment and tend to retain water around this time.) Really disappointed with myself for the deviation It just wasn't worth it.

I think that without adding the exercise into the equation, the body is creating the right environment for itself to function properly. That's enough for me at this point.

I have started a list of things that I want to do when I get to my goal weight. This includes things like joining a gym (including getting a personal trainer , starting dance classes (did tap dancing when I was younger and would love to start again), joining an indoor sports team, getting back into horse riding and the list goes on and on. That will be my reward for doing the right thing for my body!!! And I can't wait to get back into it.

Cheers
MiniMe

[asy]

I'm SO not an excercise gal. Can't stand it.

I like "incidental excersise", as in Bushwalking around our farm, Horse riding (when I can), Canoeing (but not in this weather!!!), running the sawmill, chopping down trees, etc...

BUT...

I really need (well, I feel I do) something to help tone the muscles now that I have them back!

I've been thinking about Pilates. About 2 years ago I bought a "Pilates for Dummies" DVD, but never used it (incase you were wondering), mostly because it was just ridiculous to think I could do any moving like that at the size I was...

I'm wondering what people's thoughts on doing Pilates are? Peter, I guess your probably the most experienced in it (that's posted about it). How effective do you think it'd be doing it by myself (I hate 'classes' and can't afford them anyway).

Would it help?

Are there any other things I could do?

asy

[Ecogirl]

Asy
I love both pilates and yoga - they are low impact and work on building core strength. My plan is to start studying yoga once I've finished refeed (I'm focusing on one thing at a time). You can really tone your body through either of them. They cater for all levels.

Have fun
Amanda

[Melissa]

Asy,

Pilates is the most fantasic low impact exercise to do. You may need a few initial pointers though depending on how basic the DVD starts. Just take it easy. If you find it is not what you need or can do yet I have found many different titles at the library of video shop (best to hire on their cheap day if they have one).

Melissa