Marc's Diary 2.0

[Imfef]

Hey Koh,

There are many articles you can find around the net that supports the theory of reduced metabolism, but you sort of take it as granted, with a pinch of salt.

But it was this story that caught my attention -the Biggest Loser contestants of 2009 all of whom lost a huge amount of weight only to put it back on again. This is research is unique, given the TV hype and media attention, they had a top physiologist Dr Kevin Hall measured and tracked all the KPIs of each contestant for 6 years after the event finale. Their metabolisms didn't revert to 'normal' even after 6 years.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/02/h...ight-loss.html

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...ht-is-back-up/

This applies to all diets where you have rapid weight loss over a sustained period (months or more), the only way to escape this phenomenon is opting for Gastric Bypass surgery. Not many people would go down that route though.

My thoughts...don't try to lose too much too soon and try to reduce weight steadily over time. Not ideal for me, as I know Cohens can get me great results that will make me very happy very fast. But as I said, I'll only end up back where I started.

So the question I'm asking myself is how could Cohens be adapted to reduce weight more slowly. I have tried other diets and I can't stick to them, lose ANY weight over the long term and they offer too many opportunities to fail. I need a regimen like Cohens, but maybe up the portions? Maybe start from refeed? I don't know.

Lots for me to think about as I've now had my mindset turned and not sure I can do 100% EP, now I have this knowledge/insight.

Having said that, if I had advice for any first timers, I'd say stick to Cohens 100% - do the program, experience the amazing results for yourself and then seek help from a doctor to maintain. Cohen's does a great job of getting you to your target weight, but after that I think the tools are not enough to keep you there.

[Imfef]

You might be wondering "So what are you doing now?"

Well, I'm not 100% Cohens but not following any other diet either. I am watching my carbs though - limiting myself to 30g per day, hoping to keep off the 7kg I already lost in my first week, until I can work our what I'm going to do.

[Kohinoor]

Hi Marc,
Thanks for the links. I haven't read them yet (just logged in...) but I'll find the time later today.

I need a regimen like Cohens, but maybe up the portions? Maybe start from refeed?

Depending on how you've been travelling since your first go at Cohens, perhaps your words above ARE the way to go. Have you seen this topic before? :-
http://newyouforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6408


I'd say "Take from that whatever seems to fit with you." For some who want to build their strength after completing Cohens, the call is to add an exercise regime. That requires extra food, which then requires the balancing thereof.... From what I read, exercising to build muscle mass also helps to increase your metabolism, which should lead to being able to eat more without piling weight back on.
Take special note of Shell's words early in that topic too - the "mixing up of food amounts" worked really well for her. And, she had to eat MORE to keep her weight down too.
It is all a balance - learning all of the fine tunings that suit YOU seems to be what Maintenance is all about.
Rock on Marc,


Koh



PS And one I stumbled over in a diary is worth some thought - re eating, metabolism, storing fat, etc - go here:-
http://newyouforum.com/forum/showthr...050#post304050

[Winterboots]

Hi Marc
Just a quick note as I am short of time but have just hopped back onto the forum since being away for the past month. All I can say is that Cohen's worked for me and still does since 2011. I too wanted to be slim for my 50th - better later than never. I have struggled since maintenance but that is due to exercise and finding the right balance between exercise and food. I don't worry too much what the scales says as fat turns into muscle which weighs heavier. Anyway just wanted to say that it is possible to maintain okay - I think i reached goal in May 2011 and we are now in 2018 and while I am not the size 6 -8, I am more a 8 - 10 (NZ sizing) so happy with that. I have found having exercise goals work for me. cheers WB

[Imfef]

It was exactly 10 years ago that I first started out on my journey and joined this forum. I got down to my goal weight in about 12 weeks, deviation free.
After failing to maintain and putting it all back on, and more, I made several attempts to start again but just couldn’t make a proper go of it. I lost some weight, felt good, but ultimately failed to stay on the EP for longer than a week or so.
Each time I gues I thought I was in the zone, but clearly not as I kept looking for excuses to justify giving up. If you read my posts from last summer - I was distracted by the fear of being able to maintain after making all the effort.
I tried to start from refeed, I then tried to cut carbs, I went paleo, I even considered a carnivore diet. It was a waste of time.
I started properly on EP again two and a half weeks ago. I’ve lost 7.5 kg and this time believe I’m in the zone. Time will tell I guess.
I’m not entirely deviation free. I’m not managing the 5 hours between breakfast and lunch (I’ve accepted that’s not often possible due to work), I’m sometimes skipping the breakfast or lunch meal and replace those meals with a grapefruit. I occasionally have an extra piece of fruit when I’m hungry. That’s it. Not ideal, but it’s allowing me to get through the days somewhat compliant.
Like the first time I have a goal date, holiday in Turkey ( just like first time). I’m absolutely determined to achieve my goal by then. I’m confident for the first time in ten years that I will.
I’m not thinking too far ahead, I look forward to jumping on my scales every morning and taking the small motivations from seeing a few grams loss each day and my clothes feeling a little looser. I’m looking forward to fitting some of my smaller sized clothes and that motivates me a lot too.
I’m sure my wife expects me to fail again, so I want to prove to her that I can do this.
Onward and downward...

[findingme]

Hi Marc
All the best. I know what it’s like to keep trying to get back on the Cohens wagon, but it sounds like you’re getting there.
Take care
Jen

[Kohinoor]

Hi Marc,
Good for you, for giving it another crack. Just beware of this though:-

I look forward to jumping on my scales every morning and taking the small motivations from seeing a few grams loss each day

You'll be fine as long as you don't DEPEND on seeing a small loss each day - 'cos that is not the way this works for most. There is a chart that shows AJ (Annabelle Joy) going all the way down the scale - she recorded her progress daily, and recorded the UPS and the DOWNS that happened daily.


There is even at least one week in which she GAINED weight, but there followed a huge loss soon after that brought her back to the "trend line".


Here is her spreadsheet. Maybe expect something like the same results (??) i.e. a regular weightloss over time, but not necessarily daily.
http://newyouforum.com/forum/showthr...165#post168165

(Click on the thumbnail to have it Zoom up to a readable size)





Keep on rocking,
Koh

[Imfef]

Hi Koh,
Thank you! This is a really good point for daily weighers to be aware of and well illustrated by the chart from AJ.

I'm addicted to weighing daily so I accept the fact that I may see small gains from time to time. I still have all my daily weight losses charted from my first journey and I see that I gained on five occasions and another 3 during refeed. Good to know that it's perfectly normal and others experience this, meaning it's not something you've done wrong. Like AJ, I almost always saw a redeeming loss the following day. I found that having lots of big target goals (e.g. Under 90Kg, Under 80kg), and even more mini goal targets in between, helped me keep an eye on the bigger picture/end goal.

I'm noting everything I eat on a daily basis as usual, but this time I was curious about the amount of calories I was having to see if there's any correlation between energy intake and the losses. I was surprised to work out that there's a significant difference in daily calories depending on which proteins and veg you choose - e.g. one day (for me) could total 1100 calories (especially if choosing steak and cheese on same day) while other choices may only total 700 for the day (both completely 100% personal plan compliant).

I know we don't need to count calories, but thought it was interesting nonetheless. If it looks like non-steak/cheese days shed more grams, I may decide to always stick with lower calorie options like tuna and chicken, which fill me up as much as anything, if not more. I doubt it works like that, but I'm curious to find out.

[Imfef]

3 weeks completed today which is really positive for me. Weekly loss about 1.9kg this week, so slowing down as expected, but with that comes other perks like shirts and pants becoming looser.
Only 1.4kg from my 10kg goal, so expecting that to come within the week. So glad to be sticking with it this time and determined to keep it up.

[Wendym1221]

Hi Marc
Glad to see there is another presence around this forum
I am also but on plan again after putting the weight back on
I reached goal i think was 2011 but failed to maintain and have tried again a few times but filed
I thought this round was going strong until last weekend and i pigged right out and put on 1.3kgs
I am weighing weekly and refuse to weigh more often as it did my head in a few times
I restarted 2nd Jan and had lost 11.6kgs until weighing in this morning determine to claw that gain back by next wednesday
Anyway good luck look forward to read how you are getting on

I also got so much out of this forum so keep coming back here
Cheers Wendy

[Imfef]

Hi Wendy,
Yes, it is very quiet these days. When I first started Cohens in 2009, there were hundreds of us and I found the wonderful support a big motivation.
Like you, I regained all the weight I lost first time around (and more) and have tried to restart a few times since, but just couldn't stick to the plan. The first time was exciting - a plan that worked and the amazing and fats weight loss was fascinating. Second/third times - I just focused on how hard the first time was - in terms of the food and limitations. I guess I needed to get through a few weeks to feel the difference and now I'm positive all over again. This time, I hope it's different, I feel it will be.

Good luck, stay strong, stay focused. Think about all the benefits (every time you have a craving) - not just the feeling at your target goal weight, but the great positives along the journey. I set goals, not too far apart (1-2kg) and check my progress every day (but I do weight every day) - you could do it weekly. Even now (8.5kg lost in 3 wks) I am fitting nicely into shirts that were just getting too tight
,pants that were not fitting at all 3 weeks ago. When I reach 10kg lost, I will buy myself a t-shirt one size smaller. I can't go buy expensive clothes as they won't last too long as I keep losing, but a t-shirt is a nice treat/prize.

All the best!

Marc

[findingme]

Dear Marc

Well done, keep it up, you’ll feel so good!

I agree with you. Those of us redoing a plan are at a disadvantage in some ways, but there are positives too of course, or else we wouldn’t be redoing it! I have definitely found a distinct lack of excitement, as with first time round but I’m sure it will build as the weight loss increases. We are also only accountable to ourselves whereas first time round we had a consultant, bloodtestss, refeed to get and then management guidelines. There is a saying familiarity breeds contempt, true to a degree with Cohens. But we know it works! It is for us and we can do it because we have done it before, something we need to remember. So, of course we can do it!

Take care as always, and a hello to Wendy
Jen

[Kohinoor]

Hi Jen, and hi to Marc too,

Originally Posted by findingme

Those of us redoing a plan are at a disadvantage in some ways, but there are positives too of course, or else we wouldn’t be redoing it! I have definitely found a distinct lack of excitement, as with first time round but I’m sure it will build as the weight loss increases. We are also only accountable to ourselves.....

Wise words indeed !! It is likely quite a different dynamic this time. The good stuff can come from an entirely different part of the psyche though - more like a quiet determination and contentment as you succeed, rather than the "bright lights and pizazz of a first-time stint".

It perhaps takes more guts this time too. Keep a sense of how much you are worth, and "do it for you" - even if that means you limit some of what you may do for others (that can come later again). Now and then we must put ourselves first. Have you seen this?
http://newyouforum.com/forum/showthr...671#post345671

I hope you liked it - now and then we can get caught up in "helping others" - a noble pursuit indeed. But then, now and then we also need to help ourselves, true?
Go hard Jen (and Marc) - do it for you,

Koh

[Wendym1221]

The main advantage i have found in redoing the program again is knowing how to get some flavour into the food
Furst time around i got bored with it very quickly but I think this time I am really prepared for it

The scales going down is definately an incentive to keep going
Yes Mark and Jen we can do this together

[findingme]

We can Wendy! A great effort so far.

I have noticed my tastes in food have changed a lot this time round, so it does seem a bit different, lol. Have you noticed anything food wise Marc

Also Marc, saw you are down nearly 10kg, a great start! But can you please be kind to yourself and take off the attempt you failed at, you’ve succeeded before and you will again because you know you can.

Take care
Jen.

[Imfef]

Yah, I hit my 10kg goal earlier this week. I'm now down 10.5kg in 4 weeks. Feeling good, not mirror friendly yet, but it will come. The 4 weeks seem to have flown by in fairness, so it hasn't been too much of a struggle.

I had my brother and his two girls visit us for a long weekend, which I felt would be a challenge, but glad to say I've come out the other side still on plan and on track.

I'm still deviating slightly - in full disclosure:

- Not always doing 5 hrs between breakfast and lunch (I'm not overly concerned if it's 4 hours - as I'd rather that than it be 7 or 8 hrs and push dinner back.

- This weekend was I had a Ham and Cheese Panini (estimated 400 cal). I was up the ski slopes and didn't bring my own lunch - but I swapped dinner for a grapefruit to keep my daily calorie intake intact. The next morning had my biggest loss for the week, so got away with it! Not that I intend to repeat this or make it a habit, but it's important to note that occasions like that don't mean we're 'derailed', 'off the wagon' by any means.

- When really hungry, I will have an extra piece of fruit. I allow myself this because it's better than just breaking down/giving up.

- My cracker allowance is not 2.5 hrs apart

I know my starting weight 4 weeks ago was above my starting weight in 2009, but with the slight deviations (vs none first time), I'm ahead of my total weight loss at the same stage in 2009 (4 weeks in).

Next week I have to fly to Lisbon for a conference (3 days). I'm going to do my best to calorie count those days and hope I'll be fine.

Good luck and stay focused!

[Imfef]

Well 12.9Kg done and dusted in 5 weeks, I'm really happy about that. That's 2 stones lost (for anyone who knows what I'm talking about) which is a great milestone.

I'm now in Lisbon on business and having to count calories to keep me on track. Did not too badly yesterday and found the scales were friendly this morning - although first time I stepped on them it looked like I had gained 1.3kg!! So I moved them to another part of the floor and tried again - 0.3kg loss! Phew! Moved them again twice more and same result, so what a relief.

Back home tomorrow night and looking forward to being back on plan properly. Next goal is to be in the 80's - all being well should hit that by mid-next week.

[Kohinoor]

Hi Marc,
Well done you !! Two stone gone is two sizes down for females (actually four sizes, but their clothing seems to jump in 2's most times, so I call it 2 sizes). In Australia, a few jeans might be in sizes 8,9,10,11, etc - but mostly they go up from 8 to 10 to 12 to 14. One stone gone might take a girl from a 14 to a 12, or 12 to a 10. KWIM? (Oh, and that only applies from sizes 16 downward - larger sizes than that need more than a stone gone to drop a size).

I am not sure if that same tenet applies with males as well, but if not, you should be at least 1.5 sizes down. For sure, things will be getting real baggy !! A new suit in the offing methinks.
Rock on champ,
Koh

[Imfef]

Hi Koh,

It's hard to tell going by sizes as I can either be L, XL or XXL depending on the brand and cut. However, I'm sure I'm probably one size down, but I'm losing more from my belly and less (at the moment) from my chest - those stubborn bulges to the sides of my chest take a while to reduce. That

In terms of waist size, I'm two notches tighter on the belt, so I've already disposed of some jeans that are now just to loose. Found a suitcase of old clothes, mostly size L, that I'm now fitting nicely into. Even when I reach my goal weight I won't fit into anything smaller than an M. When I reach my goal the biggest difference will be in waist size, going from 40 to 32.

Over my three days away on business, I managed to put on 0.2kg - so not too bad (I was hoping for stable) but hopefully that'll be gone by tomorrow. In 2009, when I did 14 weeks 100% deviation free, I stressed out at the thought of having to travel and how I could cope with being true to the program. This has taught me that it's not worth worrying about. Make sensible choices - stay away from my evil stuff (sweets, deserts, chips, rice, pasta, alcohol etc.) and drink as much water as possible. You won't lose too much ground doing that. Same goes for people who have an event or celebration where they just want to eat 'normally' for a day. Do it, if it's a one-off and helps you stick with the program, it should not derail you, again as long as you're sensible and then get back to plan the following day.

[Imfef]

Today is the final day of week 6. I'm really encouraged by my staying power, something I've not achieved since my first journey in 2009. I'm 13.4kg down and feeling good and really positive about reaching my goal again.
I may manage about 1kg loss for the last week , not bad considering my travel and my imperfect improvisation over the 3 days. But I'm not concerned, in fact I feel less stressed and more comfortable about short travel periods knowing I can get through it relatively unscathed (whilst allowing myself the reward of being freer during that period - and a welcome respite to be honest).

All being well, I could be into the 80's in about a week (and half way to goal) that will be another boost to my motivation and confidence. Can't wait.